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Analyzing the USC Case vs. OSU

  • With all the comparisons of the OSU case to USC, I took some time to look up the NCAA's report on USC after their hearings. I found it almost shocking how much more there was to the case.

    Most seem to believe that NCAA was given the punishment they did only because Reggie Bush (and OJ Mayo) got illegal benefits. However the reason USC got hit so hard has much more to do with WHO gave Bush/Mayo the benefits, the failure of compliance the monitor the actions of the players and follow up on possible leads, and a few other violations that showed a widespread lack of institutional control.

    The findings of the NCAA case were as follows: Violations of NCAA bylaws governing amateurism; failure to report knowledge of violations; unethical conduct; impermissible benefits; violations of coaching staff limitations; impermissible recruiting contacts by a booster; impermissible inducements and extra benefits; and lack of institutional control.

    Now there are some allegations that mirror what OSU is/may be facing, but the violations USC got hammered for the most have very little in common with OSU.

    So to break down each of the allegations...

    1. Violation of amateurism
    - Reggie Bush entered an agreement with two sports marketers/agents (along with Bush's step father) who provided Bush cash including enough for a car and accessories, travel arrangements to an NFL player's party, a Las Vegas vacation, travel for his family to the Orange Bowl and Hawaii, and a house, furniture and appliances for his family. Any college player that has an agreement with an agent is immediately ineligible.

    2. Failure to report/unethical conduct
    - An assistant coach (McNair) had a conversation with one of the agents, who tried to get the coach to make Bush adhere to the agreement or reimburse the agents for the benefits provided. The coach did not report the conversation, denied having the conversation in 2 interviews with compliance, and falsely attested he had no knowledge of violations signing a compliance certification. There was also a picture of both men together along with a celebrity mutual friend. (McNair has and is still denying evereything and currently is suing the NCAA saying the allegations are false)

    3. Impermissable benefits
    - The benefits mentioned above given to Bush by the agents
    - A woman's tennis player made over $7500 in long distance calls using a USC access code.

    4. Violation of staff limitations
    - The USC football staff hired a consultant who attended practice, analyzed video, and had discussions with Pete Carroll about his observations. Carroll did not check with USC's compliance before the hire, and USC's compliance did not even discover the illegal hire --- it was reported by another school.

    5. Impermissable recruiting contacts by a booster
    - Recruits on official visits were sent to a local restaurant owned by a USC booster who had improper contact with the recruits

    6. Impermissable benefits and inducements
    - Another athletic representative provided OJ Mayo, girlfriend, and family with cash, cell phone and service, free travel, and an arrangement to be on the cover of a magazine as incentive to sign with USC. The rep acted with knowledge of the coach and had "booster" status for previously providing a former USC athlete with air travel.

    7. LACK OF INSTITUTIONAL CONTROL
    - Reggie Bush submitted an incomplete car registration for the car provided by the agent and compliance did not require Bush to provide the missing information
    - USC arranged for Bush to have an internship with the sports marketing firm and never monitored the arrangement to see if Bush was actually showing up or doing meaningful work. They also failed to follow up on information regarding the questionable relationship between the agent that could have revealed violations (a journalist contacted USC asking for information on the agent being on the sidelines of the USC games). Compliance never met with Bush regarding the questions.
    - USC failed to monitor the recruitment of OJ Mayo and allowed a booster (who has given impermissable benefits to players in the past) to engage in recruiting on behalf of the school
    - USC did not monitor the number of football coaches and was turned in by another school
    - USC did not monitor the long distance calls made by the tennis player - 123 calls for over $7,000 from 11/06 to 3/09

    So what does this mean for OSU?

    For USC, the gigantic lack of institutional control was likely the reason why they were hit so hard. At this time, OSU shares two violations with USC - unethical conduct/failure to report violations and impermissable benefits. And one very important observations is that NEITHER OF THESE VIOLATIONS WERE USED AS BASIS FOR LOIC.

    USC got hammered because their athletic dept and compliance dept did not monitor high-risk situations even when there were huge warning signs. Some of the activities they failed to monitor - cars, player jobs, and coaching staff payroll - are basic duties of a compliance office.

    Compare that to OSU who to date has self-reported all violations, launched investigations immediately when they learned of potential issues, and self-imposed penalties on the guilty parties

    I would hope most people, when looking at the two cases, see that there is a huge gap between the severity of the cases - and there is really no reason to believe OSU will get hit as hard (let alone worse) than USC. If some of the recent accusations against OSU are found to be accurate, of course this will change. But how hard OSU gets hit will be directly related to how well compliance did their job to prevent, monitor and identify violations --- not the violations themselves.

    This post was edited by Chew86 3 years ago

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    Still not catching the ever-contagious WHINE-FLU!!!

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    Good days, bad days --- always a Buckeye. Time to begin the assault on the 2014 BCS National Championship

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  • Tweet this. Blog this. Email this. Spread this.

    Great work.

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  • I know a lot of hard work went into this, but if your goal is to spread these facts then VIP may not be the best designation for your post?

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  • The impermissible benfits have already been ruled on. To date anyway, we are only looking at the failure to report. Coupled with the fact that memoriabilia sales is not at the top of the NCAA's list of concerns, I am cautiously optomistic that we will not be kept out of a bowl game this year. I see 2010 regular season erased and probation.

  • Nice review. I agree that with what has been made public, your assesment is sound. The issue is we have the biggie on that list, Tress not reporting. If all these B.S. stories add up to being the side dishes, I can see us getting hit as hard as them. Pryor leaving was not good for us, this leads me to guess that he was going to be ineligible. If he was ineligible for different violations we are getting pretty close to USC, but you are 100% correct that we are not there yet.

  • This absolutely should be posted on the Blue Board. And I agree, sending this to Rittenberg isn't a bad idea.

    C_woodson, your clan (Wolverines) seems to lead the charge that we are and have been worse than USC. And that we thould, at minimum get the same punishments as USC or worse. What are YOUR impressions of this? I realize you have no loyalties to us. But knowing what you know, by being a premium member here, would you correct the misinformation from your fanbase if given the opportunity?

    I often go to the Scout UM Board. The minute anyone attempts to say anything that does not suggest OSU will burn, we are met with ridicule, baseless attacks and venom. Not suggesting that you, C_Woodson, are a member or associate with that board. But I don't think its much of a stretch to assume that members of whatever UM community you subscribe to share the same logic.

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    I'm all in favor of keeping dangerous weapons out of the hands of fools. Let's start with typewriters. - Frank Lloyd Wright (1868-1959)

  • I have been saying this for a while, and thanks for posting the summary. I thought I would comment before Alpha highjacked the thread.

    The biggest difference to me is the involvement of USC staff. Unlike OSU, there was staff involved in their allegations. That is a HUGE difference. Also, unless they can prove the photographer gave money to Pryor, there are no Boosters involved at OSU. Allegations to date that can be proven center on 2 things. The tat5 and Tress hiding the fact that he knew. Coach is gone, key player is gone and the rest have 5 game suspensions

    One other aspect to this that is no small deal is that it crossed over multiple sports (Lack of Institutional Control). Football, Basketball and Tennis.

    I have been saying all along OSU will not get anything near what USC did and if they do then the NCAA is no better than the People's Court and should be ashamed. The media should never dictate rulings, and I don't think they will here either. If we based rulings on smoke, Auburn would have never played for the NC.

    OSU will get a much smaller penalty than USC if nothing else surfaces and the media will go into a frenzy.

  • Chew86 said... (original post)

    Nice review. I agree that with what has been made public, your assesment is sound. The issue is we have the biggie on that list, Tress not reporting. If all these B.S. stories add up to being the side dishes, I can see us getting hit as hard as them. Pryor leaving was not good for us, this leads me to guess that he was going to be ineligible. If he was ineligible for different violations we are getting pretty close to USC, but you are 100% correct that we are not there yet.

    The NCAA has addressed Tressel not reporting in the LOA and did not levy any charges against the school as a whole. NCAA did the same thing with USC and McNair - they held him accountable for his actions and did not use that as a factor in their penalties against the institution. If Pryor got suspended because they found he was ineligible, most likely that's a good thing because it shows compliance was doing their jobs. Plus don't underestimate the weight self-reporting --- heck, USC got reported by ANOTHER SCHOOL for having too many coaches.

    The point I was trying to make is that USC did not get hit hard because of the violations individuals committed, but rather because USC completely failed to monitor their athletes, coaches and boosters. If USC would have investigated Bush the numerous times that red flags were raised (the car paperwork, the job, etc) they probably wouldn't be in this mess.

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  • This is simply an outstanding post. If a Hall of Fame existed, I would nominate this post in an instance.

    Truth be told, the media engaging in woefully agenda driven yellow journalism has blown the 'level of offenses' at OSU way out of proportion to the reality of the facts.

    There is a massive disparity if culpability, and a substantial qualitative difference in both the offenses and the actions of the administration.

    The NCAA needs to analyze this as was done here, and come up with a penalty that fully recognizes the difference in cooperation. If they don't they will send a clear statement about NOT working with them at all.

    Thanks Chew for a powerful and enlightening post that, for once, gives logic and reason to the issues.

  • Chew86 said... (original post)

    The NCAA has addressed Tressel not reporting in the LOA and did not levy any charges against the school as a whole. NCAA did the same thing with USC and McNair - they held him accountable for his actions and did not use that as a factor in their penalties against the institution. If Pryor got suspended because they found he was ineligible, most likely that's a good thing because it shows compliance was doing their jobs. Plus don't underestimate the weight self-reporting --- heck, USC got reported by ANOTHER SCHOOL for having too many coaches.

    The point I was trying to make is that USC did not get hit hard because of the violations individuals committed, but rather because USC completely failed to monitor their athletes, coaches and boosters. If USC would have investigated Bush the numerous times that red flags were raised (the car paperwork, the job, etc) they probably wouldn't be in this mess.

    I'm hoping you are right. My point was that if there are other allegations against Pryor, that could lead to LOIC/Failure to Monitor. At this point I don't think most of us would disagree that OSU failed to monitor TP well enough. I would normally agree with you that self-reporting should mitigate(and hopefully it does), but won't that be counterbalanced by the NCAA trying to be more harsh? I think the head of the NCAA saying that they are going to get tough against violaters shouldn't be underestimated, especially since Tress is caught red handed. We don't have any deniability there. I don't know how much they are going to weigh Tress is gone vs. the head coach covered up, which I don't see as being that much different than the school knew. OSU fans seem to see this as some major distinction, but he is the freaking head coach. That doesn't look good.

    I 100% agree that we don't have the culture of coruption that they did, but with the NCAA looking to get tough I'm very worried. I'm also very worried that we haven't seen the end of the allegations, it seems TP was a walking NCAA violation. Many of these non issues such as free golf, the NCAA may point to as situations where we at the least failed to monitor. As much as us OSU fans say its free golf get over it, the NCAA may not like the fact we didn't seem to investigate a possible violation at all. The NCAA isn't going to care that it goes on in every school, we are the ones sitting across the table from them.

    My point is, if when all the allegations are done we are close to as bad as USC, we should be prepared to get blasted. We need to get people to STFU when some reporter is asking questions. What the he** did the manager of that country club need to open his mouth for? If any of you are members, call and quit the club. Its these stupid side stories that are going to get us slammed. I don't think it was one item on the list of what USC got slammed for, but rather the totality. If people keep adding these side dishes for the NCAA we are going to be next.

  • Differences to consider...

    USC staff involved
    Multiple Sports
    Did not self report

    'nuf said

    Media can come back if more is proven.