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Just heard on 10TV

  • That as well as Seibert, Witherspoon is also being reported as leaving the basketball team. What is this going to mean to our depth next year?

    talbert39

  • It means Matta will continue to play 7 guys like every year lol

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    DCGWBuckeye ●

  • Addition by subtraction......he would've never been a starter on the squad.

    BUCKTOWNSON

  • Not good, however they have to do what they have to do in order to earn a potential future living for themselves.
    Of the two, Weatherspoon is the bigger loss.

    I think back 20 years ago when after losing to the Fab Five of Michigan in the Elite 8, many of us were down because we thought it was our best shot of winning a national championship with a unit led by Jim Jackson and Lawrence Funderburke.
    Knowing at least one if not both were goners after that season--along with Jamal Brown and Chris Jent, our focus then went to the incoming recruiting class.

    One of the nation's top with the likes of Greg Simpson, Gerald Eaker, Charles "Killer" Macon and Derek Anderson (who came on once Jackson gave up his senior season for the NBA).
    Within two years or less, the first three mentioned were kicked off the team for off the court indiscretions and Anderson of course transferred to UK where he won a title in '96.

    I said all of this to say that in the two weeks since losing in the semi finals, there have been rumblings of several key underclass players defecting. From Siebert and Weatherspoon to LaQuinton Ross. And unlike 20 years ago, there are no highly prized recruits coming in. So this is it. And without any talent depth down the stretch, this team will only go so far--even with a returning Craft and Thomas. You have to keep a bevy of young talent on your bench and starting roster in order to prosper long term.

    This is a critical point now because after things fell apart with the incoming '92 class, it took Buckeye basketball seven years before they were relevant again. And if this program isn't careful--esp with Indiana reemerging, MSU remaining steady and Groce taking over at Illinois, the path to a #1 tourney seed won't be as easy.

    sugarcrystal

  • sugarcrystal said...

    Not good, however they have to do what they have to do in order to earn a potential future living for themselves.
    Of the two, Weatherspoon is the bigger loss.

    I think back 20 years ago when after losing to the Fab Five of Michigan in the Elite 8, many of us were down because we thought it was our best shot of winning a national championship with a unit led by Jim Jackson and Lawrence Funderburke.
    Knowing at least one if not both were goners after that season--along with Jamal Brown and Chris Jent, our focus then went to the incoming recruiting class.

    One of the nation's top with the likes of Greg Simpson, Gerald Eaker, Charles "Killer" Macon and Derek Anderson (who came on once Jackson gave up his senior season for the NBA).
    Within two years or less, the first three mentioned were kicked off the team for off the court indiscretions and Anderson of course transferred to UK where he won a title in '96.

    I said all of this to say that in the two weeks since losing in the semi finals, there have been rumblings of several key underclass players defecting. From Siebert and Weatherspoon to LaQuinton Ross. And unlike 20 years ago, there are no highly prized recruits coming in. So this is it. And without any talent depth down the stretch, this team will only go so far--even with a returning Craft and Thomas. You have to keep a bevy of young talent on your bench and starting roster in order to prosper long term.

    This is a critical point now because after things fell apart with the incoming '92 class, it took Buckeye basketball seven years before they were relevant again. And if this program isn't careful--esp with Indiana reemerging, MSU remaining steady and Groce taking over at Illinois, the path to a #1 tourney seed won't be as easy.

    Great post sugar ! I'm wondering if Matta's philosophy is beginning to backfire on him ? I can't blame these kids at all, they want to play ! Surely if they are good enough to get recruited by tOSU then they are good enough to be starting at many other Div.1 programs.

    I hate to see kids leave but completely understand their situation, I hope they get to play wherever they transfer to.

    Formerly "Buckeye47Fan". Couldn't carry over my handle, why 247 ?

    Cable_Guy

  • Anyone know where he's going to end up?

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    GO BUCKEYES

    BIGBUCK20 ●

  • matta is worst then a little league coach playing his son and his buddies....even in blowouts the bench register's few minutes. I wonder if in his practices that he makes half the team sit and watch the starters, you know so they can practice their bench warming. dont get me wrong, I like him, he wins alot of games but if you're not in his top 6 then you're not getting in the game.

    SheridanBuckeye

  • SheridanBuckeye said...

    matta is worst then a little league coach playing his son and his buddies....even in blowouts the bench register's few minutes. I wonder if in his practices that he makes half the team sit and watch the starters, you know so they can practice their bench warming. dont get me wrong, I like him, he wins alot of games but if you're not in his top 6 then you're not getting in the game.

    With Thomas staying, the 7-8.man rotation looked pretty set anyway.

    chuck0609

  • sugarcrystal said...

    Not good, however they have to do what they have to do in order to earn a potential future living for themselves. Of the two, Weatherspoon is the bigger loss.

    I think back 20 years ago when after losing to the Fab Five of Michigan in the Elite 8, many of us were down because we thought it was our best shot of winning a national championship with a unit led by Jim Jackson and Lawrence Funderburke. Knowing at least one if not both were goners after that season--along with Jamal Brown and Chris Jent, our focus then went to the incoming recruiting class.

    One of the nation's top with the likes of Greg Simpson, Gerald Eaker, Charles "Killer" Macon and Derek Anderson (who came on once Jackson gave up his senior season for the NBA). Within two years or less, the first three mentioned were kicked off the team for off the court indiscretions and Anderson of course transferred to UK where he won a title in '96.

    I said all of this to say that in the two weeks since losing in the semi finals, there have been rumblings of several key underclass players defecting. From Siebert and Weatherspoon to LaQuinton Ross. And unlike 20 years ago, there are no highly prized recruits coming in. So this is it. And without any talent depth down the stretch, this team will only go so far--even with a returning Craft and Thomas. You have to keep a bevy of young talent on your bench and starting roster in order to prosper long term.

    This is a critical point now because after things fell apart with the incoming '92 class, it took Buckeye basketball seven years before they were relevant again. And if this program isn't careful--esp with Indiana reemerging, MSU remaining steady and Groce taking over at Illinois, the path to a #1 tourney seed won't be as easy.

    Well thought out post.

    Matta needs to start Ross and establish a real 8-man rotation next season. If not, I agree this could be a turning point for the program in the wrong direction.

    It was awful when Anderson transferred as he was definitely the cream of the crop. "Killer" Macon was a flawed player insomuch that he played a post up style with his back to the basket. The flaw was that he was like 6'5", too short to transfer what was a great high school game to the college level.

    JAG24

  • Killer had a decent couple of years at Central Michigan after he left OSU if I recall correctly. Eaker had that crazy incident where he shot out the tires on Antonio Watson's car and got kicked off and Greg Simpson was one of the biggest headcases ever at OSU. Great talent but the epitome of a thug. Not sure where he is now, but wouldn't be surprised if he is in prison.

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    UFM- His words carry weight that would break a less interesting mans jaw

    bfbuckeye ●

  • One problem we have as outside viewers is not know how these guy performed and learned in practice.......Siebert has always been a mystry to me, and Weatherspoon seemed to have some promise outside of a lob dunk.
    To me,(I have coached some basketball) Matta's problem is not developing guys to come in as a set and play together outside "mop-up roles". this has weakened the Buckeyes duing runs and foul trouble.
    When guys can come into the game as a set team, they are more confident and usually can contribute in some way. For example < develope a "rat team" like Fred Taylor did. When things are not going right. these guys come in and disrupt, the other teams offense, create turn-overs, steals and can turn a game back around......how many times this year did a team have a big run on us, and nothing was really done to stop it? Last year when things were stagnant-bring in Scott, Williams, Ross, Siebert, Ravenal and thompson or Weatherspoon....have them concetrate on pressing and disruption...... run that mode for 3-4 minutes.....then insert the first team....repeat as needed....Matta preferrs to insert individuals as needed......if they do not produce he pulls them...
    When guys know that they are on a set team or program fror insertion, they play better and play harder as a team.....this is not rocket science here.....probably one of the most mixed up and confused guys this past year was Amir Williams....will I play any this game? I played 4 minutes last game and did real good, will I get in this game?
    Matta is a great coach and has his style....I love him as the OSU coach....I do think he is too much "iron man" wiht 5-6 guys.....I hope that improves ....

    Bigjimmie

  • Bigjimmie said...

    One problem we have as outside viewers is not know how these guy performed and learned in practice.......Siebert has always been a mystry to me, and Weatherspoon seemed to have some promise outside of a lob dunk.
    To me,(I have coached some basketball) Matta's problem is not developing guys to come in as a set and play together outside "mop-up roles". this has weakened the Buckeyes duing runs and foul trouble.
    When guys can come into the game as a set team, they are more confident and usually can contribute in some way. For example < develope a "rat team" like Fred Taylor did. When things are not going right. these guys come in and disrupt, the other teams offense, create turn-overs, steals and can turn a game back around......how many times this year did a team have a big run on us, and nothing was really done to stop it? Last year when things were stagnant-bring in Scott, Williams, Ross, Siebert, Ravenal and thompson or Weatherspoon....have them concetrate on pressing and disruption...... run that mode for 3-4 minutes.....then insert the first team....repeat as needed....Matta preferrs to insert individuals as needed......if they do not produce he pulls them...
    When guys know that they are on a set team or program fror insertion, they play better and play harder as a team.....this is not rocket science here.....probably one of the most mixed up and confused guys this past year was Amir Williams....will I play any this game? I played 4 minutes last game and did real good, will I get in this game?
    Matta is a great coach and has his style....I love him as the OSU coach....I do think he is too much "iron man" wiht 5-6 guys.....I hope that improves ....

    I guess it all depends on Thad's ego. Is he like Tressel was or can he humble himself a little and make the changes ? Time will tell.

    Formerly "Buckeye47Fan". Couldn't carry over my handle, why 247 ?

    Cable_Guy

  • Bigjimmie said...

    One problem we have as outside viewers is not know how these guy performed and learned in practice.......Siebert has always been a mystry to me, and Weatherspoon seemed to have some promise outside of a lob dunk. To me,(I have coached some basketball) Matta's problem is not developing guys to come in as a set and play together outside "mop-up roles". this has weakened the Buckeyes duing runs and foul trouble. When guys can come into the game as a set team, they are more confident and usually can contribute in some way. For example < develope a "rat team" like Fred Taylor did. When things are not going right. these guys come in and disrupt, the other teams offense, create turn-overs, steals and can turn a game back around......how many times this year did a team have a big run on us, and nothing was really done to stop it? Last year when things were stagnant-bring in Scott, Williams, Ross, Siebert, Ravenal and thompson or Weatherspoon....have them concetrate on pressing and disruption...... run that mode for 3-4 minutes.....then insert the first team....repeat as needed....Matta preferrs to insert individuals as needed......if they do not produce he pulls them... When guys know that they are on a set team or program fror insertion, they play better and play harder as a team.....this is not rocket science here.....probably one of the most mixed up and confused guys this past year was Amir Williams....will I play any this game? I played 4 minutes last game and did real good, will I get in this game? Matta is a great coach and has his style....I love him as the OSU coach....I do think he is too much "iron man" wiht 5-6 guys.....I hope that improves ....

    spot on +1

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    Heisman Status

    DZforTHREE

  • cant blame a single guy for wanting to transfer. this is the risk you take when you play 6 or 7 guys all year long

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    great2belucky

  • Bigjimmie said...

    One problem we have as outside viewers is not know how these guy performed and learned in practice.......Siebert has always been a mystry to me, and Weatherspoon seemed to have some promise outside of a lob dunk. To me,(I have coached some basketball) Matta's problem is not developing guys to come in as a set and play together outside "mop-up roles". this has weakened the Buckeyes duing runs and foul trouble. When guys can come into the game as a set team, they are more confident and usually can contribute in some way. For example < develope a "rat team" like Fred Taylor did. When things are not going right. these guys come in and disrupt, the other teams offense, create turn-overs, steals and can turn a game back around......how many times this year did a team have a big run on us, and nothing was really done to stop it? Last year when things were stagnant-bring in Scott, Williams, Ross, Siebert, Ravenal and thompson or Weatherspoon....have them concetrate on pressing and disruption...... run that mode for 3-4 minutes.....then insert the first team....repeat as needed....Matta preferrs to insert individuals as needed......if they do not produce he pulls them... When guys know that they are on a set team or program fror insertion, they play better and play harder as a team.....this is not rocket science here.....probably one of the most mixed up and confused guys this past year was Amir Williams....will I play any this game? I played 4 minutes last game and did real good, will I get in this game? Matta is a great coach and has his style....I love him as the OSU coach....I do think he is too much "iron man" wiht 5-6 guys.....I hope that improves ....

    Excellent post. Although Taylor was before my time, establishing a rotation and using a substitution pattern in a strategic manner is the only thing that is keeping Matta from winning a championship. He's just not comfortable using a bench and doesn't have a good feel for substitution. That's why we always seem to play the style and tempo that is set by the opposing coach. Matta needs to recognize that his "play the hell out of my best 5" strategy has limitations and try to do something different. You may sacrafice early in the season and lose some games by experimenting with different line-ups and allowing younger guys to get experience in tight games, but come tournament time, you will have a bench developed to punch and counterpunch with the best opposing teams and coaches.

    Zero points (and zero shots) off the bench against Kansas says it all.

    JAG24

  • JDW and Siebert were the 10th and 11th man off the bench this. I don't care what team you play for, you're not going to get a lot of minutes with 9 guys in front of you. I would love for them to stay, bust their tails and maybe be a contributor down the road, but you can't expect any coach to play his 10th or 11th guy a bunch of minutes. I think a lot of this bench stuff is BS, KY just crushed everyone this year playing 6 guys. I think there is room for improvement with his use of the bench, but it has been largely overblown.

    I don't attend practices, but the fact that they both got passed up by a bunch of freshman, the fact Matta stated publicly this was a poor practice team and it wasn't the freshman makes me think there are attitude issues, which need to change or they need to be shown the door.

    Sugar, I completely disagree with your assessment. We went through seven years of crappy basketball because Randy Ayers was a terrible coach. As soon as he left, things started turning around. Its also a lot different having three starters booted off the team for disciplinary reasons than having your 3rd stringers transfer. Which brings me to another point, Matta has done a great job keeping his players out of trouble and getting them to succeed in the classroom. JDW is one exception. Frankly, you don't need to be even remotely smart to get a 2.0 in college, you just have to be willing to work. The fact that he was ineligible last year also confirms my suspicion that he may have an attitude/work ethic problem. He is clearly very gifted athletically, my suspicion is that if he dedicated himself he would be a starter for this team. Why give him minutes on the floor just to keep him happy? He should earn those minutes.

    Matta has had his fair share of guys transfer out, and how many of them have we missed? Walter Offutt would be the closest one, and he is a good MAC player, which means to me he would be a solid bench guy for us, that's about it. Haven't heard much (good at least) about Crater, Wallace, etc.

    highlandbuck

  • Bigjimmie said...

    One problem we have as outside viewers is not know how these guy performed and learned in practice.......Siebert has always been a mystry to me, and Weatherspoon seemed to have some promise outside of a lob dunk. To me,(I have coached some basketball) Matta's problem is not developing guys to come in as a set and play together outside "mop-up roles". this has weakened the Buckeyes duing runs and foul trouble. When guys can come into the game as a set team, they are more confident and usually can contribute in some way. For example < develope a "rat team" like Fred Taylor did. When things are not going right. these guys come in and disrupt, the other teams offense, create turn-overs, steals and can turn a game back around......how many times this year did a team have a big run on us, and nothing was really done to stop it? Last year when things were stagnant-bring in Scott, Williams, Ross, Siebert, Ravenal and thompson or Weatherspoon....have them concetrate on pressing and disruption...... run that mode for 3-4 minutes.....then insert the first team....repeat as needed....Matta preferrs to insert individuals as needed......if they do not produce he pulls them... When guys know that they are on a set team or program fror insertion, they play better and play harder as a team.....this is not rocket science here.....probably one of the most mixed up and confused guys this past year was Amir Williams....will I play any this game? I played 4 minutes last game and did real good, will I get in this game? Matta is a great coach and has his style....I love him as the OSU coach....I do think he is too much "iron man" wiht 5-6 guys.....I hope that improves ....

    Dead on.

    Basketball is more than just production on the court its also about developing players for the future. I have always said the biggest problem with Matta is that he can't develop a good Big man. Granted that the guys that he has had came in at a high skill level and never really progress after that. Matta by not playing his bench during the season is only really hurting his team during tourney time as well for the next season because they have no game experience coming in to the season. IDK if Matta is relying on his recruiting ability to bring in the next big thing, but that dosen't always pan out so you must develop what is already in the program. I really feel OSU will be ok for next year but if things dosen't change it could become a problem in the future.

    cew31

  • hmmm

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    "Coaches who can outline plays on a black board are a dime a dozen. The ones who win get inside their players heads and motivate them."

    tangosucka

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    keith772

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    McCague

  • Just to play devil's advocate, there's some nitpicking about a coach that's even to two final fours in 5 years, and multiple BIG championships.

    Thad can do a little better, but Seibert knows he was stuck behind Craft, and I don't know much about the Witherspoon except that he wasnt a good shooter.

    This is still a talented team with a lot of alleged talent on the bench. If Craft can really work on his shot, and Williams and Smith show continued improvement, ESP Smith after his nice tournament, this is going to be a balanced fun team to watch next year.

    The future is bright.

    chuck0609

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